Second Dates
Tonight was the third in our nightly series: “First Dates With the Tin Man.”
Tonight’s date — my second DateBait match — was tall, intelligent, friendly, well-spoken, and polite, with very dreamy eyes. We sat and talked over dinner.
This dating thing is kinda fun.
I’m sleepy, and I have “Buffy” episodes to watch. So I’ll turn this over to you, my readers, with a question. Because a questioning Tin Man is a happy Tin Man. I also mean it to be sort of a discussion-provoker.
First of all, most of us have heard that old joke:
Q: What does a lesbian bring on a second date?
A: A U-Haul.
Q: What does a gay man bring on a second date?
A: What second date?
Forget the gay-male stereotype for a moment. Because I really wanna know:
How do you know if you should go on a second date with someone?
It’s as simple as ‘do I want to go on a second date with this guy?’
If you do, then go on a second date. If not, then don’t.
The question becomes ‘how do I know if I want to go on a second date?’ Sometimes it’s obvious. But most gay ‘dates’ in my experience start with hello and end a couple of hours later with tissues. Not the greatest way to build a relationship. Sometimes there’s conversation too. Sometimes it’s all conversation and not even as much as a peck on the cheek. So you have to ask if you enjoyed talking to the guy in question, and if you want more.
The scary bit is calling him up, I found. Talking to him or a machine and saying ‘hey, I really enjoyed dinner/drinks/carnal knowledge/whatever the other night. I was wondering if we could get together again sometime?’ Because then you’re faced with the possibility of rejection. Another issue for another time.
Back to the question: how do you know if you should go on a second date with someone? If it feels right. Gut instinct. And that’s regardless of sexuality.
I had a date the other night. It was one of the best dates I have had in a while because sex was simply not an issue. And even though we didn’t kiss, there was a hint of sex, as he did figure out and enjoy the fact that I am ticklish. I don’t think he would have done that if he did not find me of some sort of sexual interest. Aside from those future possiblities, we had a great time. Good conversation, and we even played around on the piano, something I most always do not do with someone – so I was comfortable with him. I’ve had the sex dates, and I’ve had the conversation, but please don’t touch me dates. If you have a date which not only has the conversation, but the physical interest as well, I think it would be worth taking that chance on a second date. We plan to, and hopefully, it will lead to greater things (but I’m smart enough to not dwell there either).
How about if you want to see him again? Or is that too simple a thought? ;-)
In my experience, it’s as easy as: “Did I have fun on the first date? Is this person attractive to me? Given the chance, would I go on that first date again?”
If Yes, have a second one. If No, stay home and watch Buffy. For the third date: lather, rinse, repeat.
But then, I’m a lesbian, so what do I know… ;)
Good question. Like a good lawyer, I’ll say: “It depends.”
Generally, it comes down to what you think is right for you–there is no right answer. But there are a couple of specific kinds of situations I have in mind.
First, sometimes you learn something about someone on a first date that you want to experience in the future. For example, one time I met someone who mentioned that he loves to go to museums on Friday evenings. I know nothing about art. It was a clear-cut idea for another activity and another way to get to know the person. My personal museum tour (followed by watching a Knicks game) was my single most memorable date so far.
Without such specific cues, it depends on where you are. If you are in a situation where you are gaining experience about what is most important to you, I think “erring” on the side of a second date is absolutely the best approach. A first date can be odd. There is the task of “breaking the ice,” specially with meeting people from the net, or people you met in the wee hours at, say, Barracuda (not that I would know anything about that, of course.) A first date is barely more than some kind of sanity/reality check, I think. With each subsequent meeting, you get to know each other a little better, and have a more realistic perspective of all dimensions, as opposed to the usual IPO-like “pop” at the outset.
On the other hand, if you DO know what you want, and your instinct is that you didn’t see it on the first date, then why waste your time? Only you can decide where you are. In the case of an intelligent person, I think you should trust your instincts.
I’ll reiterate the comments made above. I think it’s just that you inherently know if you want a second date or not — hardly any questioning usually goes on in my head as with to that second date question. I do feel if I have that second date, then the guy will think I want a third or fourth (or more!) which isn’t necessarily true. I’m not a touchy-feely kind of person and those first dates where the guy is all over me with his hands (holding hands while walking along the street, etc.) really bugs me and that’s usually my sign for no second date. I guess I read it as a bit too “needy” for me and that’s a turn off. Not sure if that helps ya…
Thanks, folks. Good, good stuff.
I guess I’m also thinking, well, what does one do on a second date? On the first date, we had drinks or a meal and a long conversation. What next?
So then I think, well, what do I do when I get together with a friend? Go to the movies, have dinner, catch up on each other’s lives, go to a bar. But you don’t want to go to a bar on a date, because there’s too much competition around. And you don’t need to catch up, because you just saw the guy last week. I guess you can go to the movies — which brings up the scary hold-hands-or-don’t-hold-hands issue.
I think mostly I’m scared. Scared that by the second date, there’ll be nothing left to talk about. Scared that it’ll be awkward. I’ve had some pretty awkward second dates, even if we haven’t already fooled around sexually.
But maybe these are just things you have to go through. Because eventually you’ll get to a second date where things are not so awkward. And then you can move on to the third date.
Whew. All part of the dating experience, eh?
Thanks for such a great topic of discussion, and a way to procrastinate some necessary but totally mind-numbing digital housekeeping.
I think the concern you raise is a completely valid one. But if that’s what you are sensing, maybe it’s worth trying some “activity”-based second dates. A movie. A play. A museum. A concert. A ball game. Scrabble. A walk. Followed by dinner or drinks, where you can talk about what you just experienced. We all have our things we love to talk about. If you do something of interest to someone, you’ll have an easy springboard for new discussion.
You’re allowed to be selfish, too, you know. One time I wanted to see a particular play, and I sort of contrived the second date just to have company to go see it. I got to see my play, and we talked about it at dinner, and rather than doing mindless digital housekeeping, I saw something interesting.
I’ll also add what I *don’t* want to do on a second date–the same thing I did on the first. I want to see increasing slices of someone’s complex personality each additional time, not experience the same slice twice. You’re figuring out if you have chemistry. Simply rehashing the bar outing adds nothing, in my view. Unless it’s a dramatically different kind of bar. :-)
I guess I can only echo what others have already said, but to me it all boils down to this: If you want to go on a second date, and frankly, it sounds like you do, then go!
It is just a date after all. And you certainly don’t want to spend the rest of your life wondering “What if I’d asked him out on a second date?”
As far as what to do on a second date, perhaps you should think of a second date as opportunity to figure out if you want to have a third date. Seriously. If you’re on the fence about a second date, than that means that must be some potential there, but you just don’t know how much. I suspect a second date would remedy that. Just pick a setting where you could get to know him better (i.e., probably not a bar) and let it go where it goes. Who says you can’t have dinner twice in a row?
Whatever you do, have fun. :-)
What to do on a second date? I’m going on a first date tomorrow night and we had a lenghty conversation about what constitutes a good first/second date…so your entry is timely. Well, we decided a first date of dinner/drinks. And if it goes well, we’re going to an art opening on Saturday. The jist of our deal was 1/ get to know something about each other and if you click then 2/ do something social and/or educational and/or stimulating and/or familiar. Just my 2 cents.
Actually, the joke as I’ve always known it is this:
What does a gay man bring on a second date?
What’s a second date?
Dating will not work if it’s still a question of ticking off the minutes until you hop in bed! It’s about finding out if you want someone to be part of your life, without even worrying about sex, which complicates things for too many people. You can always train someone to fuck later on, once you really get to know someone…
Second date: do the same as the first date. Hey, it worked the first time.
If it’s going further, then that happens behind the scenes. Moments of touching that seem accidental or natural, that sort of thing. Body language is usually reliable.
If it’s going to go beyond dinner and a drink let it get there naturally. If it isn’t, you’ll know.
I thought second dates were really just a str8 thing and that, in GayWorld, anything beyond the first date (i.e., “one night stand”) is merely a fuck-buddy.
Now, how all this fits in when there hasn’t been any touching… actually, i don’t think there is a term for that.
;-)
.rob
I have two favorite second dates–1. top of the empire state building or the staten island ferry (preferably late at night)(havent done either since 9/11 so it may evoke different reactions now)–I like these primarily because no new yorker ever does either voluntarily–shows flexibility, gives you time to talk and particularly at the top of the esb you learn where he has lived in nyc, how much he knows about where he lives, literally how wide a world view he has etc
2. korean bar b que or some other cuisine he s not familiar with — is he adventuresome?
how does he deal with new things?
i want to know more about how he thinks and behaves, what his past is, what he thinks about the future-